Meggie Palmer spoke to career guru Emily Liou about Job Hunting in Times of Crisis. Emily shared her wisdom on how to navigate job hunting in any economic environment.
I used to be a former recruiter. I hired and interviewed thousands of candidates but I was never able to give them honest feedback on why they weren't advancing or what they needed to really improve upon. And so, in 2016, I actually started Cultivitae a which stands for cultivate your life. Today, I help job seekers really master the job search process. I truly believe we were never taught the skills on how to build a personal brand, how to network, how to interview, how to negotiate. It's just so awesome to be able to help people just learn what they actually need to do to set themselves up for success, even more so now with our current economy and just the way that it's going. So, I'm excited to talk to you guys all today.
Meggie: We're so excited as well, Emily. I just want to get a sense from you. Obviously, the economy is struggling right now. And you know, there are expectations that unemployment will spike to some of the highest levels we've seen in a very, very little time. Is anyone hiring? For anyone who’s freaking out or lost their job, are people hiring? I think we've spoken about this offline and it's actually quite surprising that there are still jobs out there.
Is anyone still hiring during a crisis?
Emily: Absolutely! I think that's a misconception that when we're in a recession, everybody is unemployed. Even if you look at the 2008 recession, the unemployment rates spiked to 12%. Meaning, 12% of the nation was unemployed. But if you do the math, that means 88% we're actually employed. So, the same thing is happening now.
There are companies that are really struggling, for instance: airlines and hospitality. They’re really affected by the COVID-19 lockdown. However, there are also companies that are just really growing, excelling, and thriving right now. We're all bingeing on Netflix at this time. We're all shopping on Amazon. These are the companies that are really thriving. So, in any type of recession, we can't just sit there and wait for things to turn around.
Recessions typically last for more than a year, right? We're not going to be unemployed for more than a year. We're gonna try to figure out how to pivot. I actually have some tips for those who are watching. If you want to really take a look at what companies are hiring, I recommend two things.
One, even if you're not a recruiter, go ahead and go into Indeed.com, LinkedIn, or whatever job board. Type in ‘recruiter’ and the zip code or the city that you want to work in. What's going to happen is it's going to show you all of the results of companies that are saying, ‘Hey, we're hiring for recruiters right now.’ And recruiters are always hired to hire talent, not to fire talent. So, that's one good way of really starting to identify what companies in your area are really growing during this time, or are really ramping up their hiring efforts.
The second tip I have is just going into whatever title you are targeting. Typing in your zip code or city and location, go ahead to the filter section and go by date posted and check what's been posted in the last 24 hours or the last week because you will see companies are hiring. They're not just posting for the sake of posting. Just FYI, it actually costs a lot of money to post jobs online, especially on LinkedIn.
So, if you want high-quality jobs, take a look at LinkedIn, jobs board, and start looking at what companies are hiring right now and find that evidence. Find that proof because the minute you tell yourself, no one's hiring, or maybe people around you are telling you no one is hiring, that could be so defeating. And of course, you're not going to want to go forth with your job search. Let me tell you this: good people are always getting hired in any economy.
Meggie: Yeah, I just think that's such good advice because it's very easy to get stuck in this negative cycle of people having been laid off, asked to take a 50% pay cut, and then look for another job. I think there's a lot of people who've been furloughed, people who've been asked to take annual leave. Perhaps, you feel like you want to get out now and you might be coming from a place of fear, right? Because a lot of people have lost their jobs and a lot of people are second people right now.
But, I think your point is a good one and that is for good people. Fo good companies, they always need people. I think there's a lot of companies, PepTalkHer included, we are fortunate that we've been able to retain all of our staff and that our business is going well. But I think we're on the lookout for great talent who may be looking for jobs or who have sadly lost their job. How can we help support them? Who are those people out there who may be previously wouldn't have been able to hire because they had other jobs?
I'm really interested to know. We've had people who have lost their job and are about to step into that hiring process. They're feeling like it's been a blow to their confidence, or they're not feeling their best right now because of all this anxiety.
What are some steps that people can take to get into a good mindset to be looking for that next job?
Emily: I agree with all of that. There's always an opportunity and it's just really finding companies like PepTalkHer that are thriving and hiring at this time. I think, as an employer, it’s key to keep your eye out for talent. For those of you who have been affected by a recent layoff, the first thing I want to tell you is: one, don't look at this as a shameful or like you're wearing a scarlet letter type incident because it's happening across the board. Employers recognize that. They understand that. And, they understand that it's not due to performance-related issues or not showing up to work. It's really just due to the economy and things beyond our control.
So, I really want to highlight that because I feel that a lot of people bring a lot of shame when they're laid off, even if it's a mass layoffs. Acknowledge that it's 100% understandable and it's 100% going to allow you to find another opportunity that's in better alignment for you. That's one.
Then, two is: I recommend everybody to come up with a ‘brag list of the things either small or large that I've accomplished in my last workplace.’ If you've been feeling really unconfident with stepping forward in your job search because you're going to realize you have so much to offer, I think this practice really comes into play, not just for updating your resume where you can start to recognize, ‘oh, yeah, I did this and this and this, and I forgot to put that on there.’
Also, just walking into an interview and just stepping into that confidence that you bring to the table. I think a lot of us don't give ourselves enough credit and we don't recognize that all of the achievements we've had. Especially us that are really ambitious, we tend to just check things off the list and go for the next thing. But we really need to kind of catalog “Okay, here's everything that I did that I'm really proud of. And here's why this employer, whatever employers next are going to be really lucky to have me”, the more you can ground yourself into that and really trust, that is when you're going to excel and kind of thrive in your job search as quickly as possible.
“Just walking into an interview and just stepping into that confidence that you bring to the table. I think a lot of us don’t give ourselves enough credit and we don’t recognize all of the achievements we’ve had. Especially us that are really ambitious, we tend to just check things off the list and go for the next thing.”
Meggie: No, I love that you say that. And it's funny. This idea of a brag list is actually very similar to the reason why we built the PepTalkHer app actually. In the first instance, it's all about tracking your success regularly because I think often we forget the value that we've contributed to a workplace or how we've contributed to culture. I think the idea of having a brag list or using the PepTalkHer app, whether you use a notebook and excel sheet, a Google Sheet, whatever it is, it doesn't matter as long as you're tracking those successes on a regular basis. Because you never know when you're going for a job interview or a promotion at your current job. You'll need that data to back up your argument as to why you're the best person for that job. So, I love that. I love having a brag list.
If you don't already have one, you can use the PepTalkHer app. It's free. You can download it on Apple and Google as well. So, I highly recommend that. Then, what about other things? Should everyone be making sure their LinkedIn is up to date? Should everyone be on Twitter?
What are some practical things that people should do to be on top of all the ways that recruiters may be testing you out?
Emily: Oh my gosh, I love that you brought up LinkedIn more than you did the resume. I am a firm believer that LinkedIn is the ultimate tool to find your dream job and I personally believe it's more important than your resume because one it allows you to be found. Every single day, recruiters whether they're headhunters or corporate recruiters, they're actually looking on LinkedIn to find people who can fill the skills gap.
What I would say is LinkedIn absolutely is really, really key. And also, really building your personal brand and making sure that things are consistent with your resume, your LinkedIn if you have a digital online portfolio. Now, this isn't necessary for a lot of industries or functions like online digital portfolios. If you're a graphic designer, I would absolutely have one if you're doing something with the digital space. But you want to think about how, at this stage and at this time, do I stand out amongst other candidates? What can I do to really showcase what it is I can do, who I serve, how we can help?
The more you can include these on your LinkedIn, your resume, your portfolio, this is what's going to allow you to stand out as a candidate, and also be visible for those opportunities. I actually had a client recently who shared a screenshot of why she joined one of my programs, and it just blew my mind.
So, FYI, for those that don't know the Glassdoor stat shows on average for every single job posting out there, they get about 250 applications or 250 resumes. However, she sent a screenshot just from yesterday, that really highlighted how many applicants have applied to each job. One of them was like 2050 applications. The other was like 1786 applications. So, I always tell people just because we're in this economy now, your job search strategy shouldn't change. You still need a personal brand, your resume, your LinkedIn, your portfolios. You always need to network and really build that up.
I do believe now more than ever, you need to network, and build those referrals. Build those internal ambassadors, because how else are you standing out against the 2000 plus resumes that you're competing against?
Right now, we have officially turned into a company driven market. So prior to this, unemployment rates were 3.5%, which meant there were actually more candidate IDs, sorry for job postings, and there were candidates available. But today with the unemployment rates and unemployment claims rising, there is now a shift where companies have more candidates than they do have jobs available. So we have to really start thinking strategically how do we stand out? How do we beat out all of those other applicants and I can share so much that so much of it goes to building a relationship, building rapport, and building a connection internally.
Meggie: I agree with that because I think you know, sometimes people even before all of this has happened. But people would move to New York where I'm based and say, “Oh, you know, I can't get a job I've been applying on LinkedIn, I can't get a job”. And I just don't think applying on LinkedIn is enough. Like I think having a strong LinkedIn profile is so essential. But I think that unless, to your point, Emily, unless you have relationships and unless you're fostering relationships, it's so hard to stand out from the algorithm, right?
Like if someone's getting 2000 job applicants, how are you going to get to the top of that pile? So, I want to share one story from my fiance when he got his job. He was applying on LinkedIn not getting any love. And he eventually came up with a shortlist of companies where he would love to work, where he believed in their mission, he loved the work that they were doing. Then, he reached out not to the CEO but some of the senior executives and asked them if they'd allow him to buy them a coffee to talk specifically about excellence and issue and that's actually how he ended up getting his job. Would you believe it?
One of them took a chance, didn't have to but did. And the 15-minute coffee turned into a half-hour coffee which turned into 7-10 interviews and now he still works there.
For people who feel uncomfortable about starting to build relationships, what are great baby steps that they could take?
Emily: I love that story. I have one that I could share about my husband really quick because he also was applying online. Not asking me for help, because he was doing the thing… And then after three and a half weeks, he was so frustrated because he was customizing every resume, every cover letter like ‘I'm not getting any jobs’ and very similar to your fiancé. You know, he actually took it to LinkedIn and got really strategic on how do we find the companies that are hiring? How do you reach out to your future manager? What do you need to say to them? And he just started sending out these messages and ended up getting a job offer that he never applied to. The recruiter told him, ‘You need to apply now because we have to push you in the back system.’
Be personable
I would say for anybody who is unsure of how to reach out, I would say really three things like one: always be personable, customize your message, and really speak from like the heart. A lot of us, when we are reaching out to an employer, we do care about their mission. We do care about the company or the product or the service or reputation. So, what is it about that company out of all of the companies out there that made you reach out? The more you get personable with the company or paying a genuine compliment to whoever you're reaching out to based on what you see on LinkedIn or their social media, that immediately is going to build rapport. Immediately they're going to be like, ‘Okay, let me read the rest of this and see how I can help.’ Because the flip side of that is so many job seekers send out really generic messages that are just like, ‘Hey, I'm on the market. Does somebody like me?’
I always tell my clients, most people don't know how to reach out. So, when you're standing out immediately, you're separating yourself from the pack. And when they actually receive your message, they'll be excited. They'll be like, ‘wow, okay, who is this person? What do they have to offer?’ That's exactly why I always tell people to work on your LinkedIn first, because out of genuine curiosity, they're going to click on your LinkedIn message. That's going to be your interim resume. So, going back to the messaging, always feel like a connection of rapport right off the bat.
Summarize your background
The second thing is I believe that it's really important to summarize your background and what it is you can do for that organization. Where is it that you can add value because the flip side of that, again, is so many people are really generic about what they do: ‘I'm a project manager with five years of experience. Do you have a job for me?’ It's really important to make sure you know what you're highlighting so that the person who is reading that has the dots connected. They know exactly how you're connecting your background to the problem or the problem you want to solve or the solution that you're willing to offer.
Have a clear CTA
Then, I would say the third part of that message is really having a clear call to action. So many people leave it really open-ended like, ‘please let me know if you have any questions or feel free to chat with me if you want to have coffee, so I could pick your brain.’ Having that clear call to action and that very specific thing that you want them to do and really take action on is key.
I always tell my clients like give two options: ‘are you available this Tuesday at 3pm Pacific or this Thursday at 4pm?’ People need to be told what to do. Otherwise, if it's in the limbo, they're not going to do it right. And then the worst case, they just tell you, ‘I want to connect but I'm actually only available these days and times’ And then you work your schedule around that because they're doing you a favor.
Meggie: I think that's so great. We always do that in our emails as well when we're prospecting with new corporate clients who pickpocket. Give a specific time that suits and obviously, leave the door open. It makes it really easy for people to say yes.
Should you be trying to create your dream job within a company? Do you always have to look externally? Can you try and create a role that you would love within the company where you are right now?
Emily Oh, good question. What I would say is now more than ever, it's important to pivot and look for opportunities because COVID-19 has really shaken up every single business. Every single business is now pivoting in some way. And before, you may have been doing this one job and doing this one job really well.
So, you're in the event space, you're you used to be out, like on the ground, in-person with people, coordinating these big massive events. But now since everything's going digital, you can absolutely figure out what are the gaps right now?
We should all be stepping up as leaders and really asking, what does our employer need from us? What can we do to solve the problems right now that are happening and unprecedented? It's absolutely perfect for you to come up with a proposal: ‘You know, this is where I'm seeing, there are some gaps. This is what our organization needs right now. I believe that I could do XYZ for us.’ The more you can do that and step into that leadership role, your leaders are going to recognize you for that. They're going to remember that because a lot of us are scared and panicked and fearful and we're just trying to get our jobs done and hopefully survive. But, the more you can step into that leadership role and really propose solutions, you're going to not only secure a better job for yourself now but also in the future.
So, I'm 100% for creating new roles and really partnering with your manager and just saying: ‘can we do this? Is this possible and present those solutions to them?’
“There’s always opportunity. And it’s just really finding the companies like PepTalkHer that are thriving and hiring at this time. ”
Previously, we wrote something about How to Grow a Money Mindset and How to Set Yourself Up for Financial Freedom. You might want to go ahead and check it out.
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